Curse

The Ernada · Mar 23, 2007, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuriousCarrie

As for the rest of you, you complain and moan about our whining. Wow... just stop! We may also have an opinion.

And there were others, including me, who have opinions as well that were criticisms. But the difference is that I didnt go ranting and whining about how ANET "betrayed" us. Or how GW is dying. Or how GW is just a clone of WoW.

Don't assume that just because I find all this whining annoying and premature, and yes it's whining, that I find ANET to be perfect. I dont like the high level cap or the apparent removal of heroes/henchies, but I speak my opinions without sounding like a kid throwing a tantrum. Just look at your post. Half of it was personal attacks directed towards me when I didnt even mention you at all.

As for your proof that GW2 is a failure just because you talked to a few people in local chat who said they werent going to buy GW2? We are supposed to take that as proof? Hell, the other day people were talking about Hiltler being a hero. So is that proof as well?

MSecorsky · Mar 23, 2007, 10:09 PM // 22:09

Hey... I just read the articles on GW2... it is so not going to be WoW. They have something far superior in the works. I've lost all reservations at this time.

Cjlr · Mar 23, 2007, 10:11 PM // 22:11

And I thought my English class was bad... It is, but hey, I guess when you've got sufficiently large numbers of self-absorbed and egocentric halfwits you'll always end up in the same place. Don't worry, I'm not talking about you. But read a few posts and I'm sure you'll figure out who I am talking to. Please insert tongue in cheek now. Head up ass optional.

I once heard a story about a king who ordered his wise men to give him a gift. This gift would have to be something that would make him happy when he was sad and sad when he was happy. They came back with a ring, and on it were inscribed the words: "This too shall pass". The moral of the story being, of course, that you should never bet on an eggplant. But also that everything has its end. What kind of blithering idiot would you have to be to presume that by playing Guild Wars you have wasted your time, given that it will not be permanent? Nothing is permanent! The sole, exclusive, lone, singular reason why ANYONE, EVER, would (should?) play a game is for fun. Did you have fun playing Guild Wars? If yes, you did not waste your time. If no, may I inquire as to just what exactly you thought you were doing? It's flawed reasoning to say that is has been and continues to be a waste of time. Once upon a time in the future, I'll wake up dead. Does that stop me from doing stuff now? A movie will end. Does that make it a waste of time to watch? Our species is doomed. Our planet is doomed. Our universe is doomed. Does that mean that logically, everything will come to nothing, and so therefore we should never bother doing anything, ever? I probably got carried away with that comparison (or rather, I definitely did) but the principle is sound. And of course, if everything is meaningless anyway, there can't be such a thing as 'not a waste of time' in the first place...

As for character transfers... Why does it even matter? I know it'd be nice, and god knows I'd love it, but why would you even expect it? I love my chars. And I'll love my new ones. A character is defined by a few, physical (well, virtual) modifiers. Appearance, height, class, name, et cetera. Beyond that there is whatever world you have constructed around your character. Life, times, family, friends, deeds, sins, past, present, and future. But that doesn't exist in the game... That exists in YOU. Yes, that means you, person of the year 2006. Your character is only a few bits of data. You are the only one who makes it more than that - you can make it a great story. But that doesn't go away. It might stop progressing, kind of like every work of fiction ever, but it doesn't go away. The cruelest part of every fiction is that it eventually ends. But it doesn't end there. It ends when you let it. If it matters to you it will stay with you. Isn't that enough? I'll ask again: what's the big deal? I just don't see it.

As for actually discussing Guild Wars Two:

Races. Seriously, what? Why? I've always said that it seems like there are several races in GW lore which are a fair match for humans. Charr, tengu, centaurs, and the like. So let us play as them, if anything. But on the whole the races dealie is never something that I care about. That's if it's done well; if it's done poorly, then it's hell. Appearance, and to some extent things like starting location or gear, I could care less about. But anything which means translates to "Race Y makes the best Class X, period" is a pile of excrement. And the other thing I hate is that races are so often pigeonholed and stereotyped up the yin-yang. Because, as I'm sure you know, all members of one race are the same. And all elves are either tall, haughty arcanists, or forest-dwelling. bow-wielding little snots. And dwarves drink lots of alcohol - and never you mind what they make it out of, since they always live under mountains where they certainly couldn't grow cereal crops. And any species that's short and silly looking is mechanically inclined. And humans are baseline, because that's the easy way out. Please, please, for the love of god and all that is holy, please don't go that way. Come up with something interesting and unique. GW has done a fair job with that so far. I'm not as worried as I could be. Yet.

The level cap. It has one reason to exist, but it's a compelling one. Eleven. And that's it. Because bigger numbers are always better! But just because the cap is higher doesn't mean there will be lots of grind. That's a complete false association many people's parts. We don't know anything about how it will work. So don't pretend you do. Okay? Deal. Let's say it takes thirty hours to reach level twenty. Who's to say it won't take thirty hours to reach level one hundred? And who's to say it won't take three hundred? Not you, that's for sure. So don't.

EDIT: I sound like such an ass... Oh well, can't be helped now.

Retribution X · Mar 23, 2007, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Sylvani will be better casters, Asurains will be better warriors, Norns ranged, Charr, Who knows, and Who cares?

clawofcrimson · Mar 23, 2007, 10:29 PM // 22:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Retribution X

....Asurains will be better warriors, Norns ranged,

warrior asurans?? um no.... if you read the article you would know this is not the case. they pride themselves in knowledge and skillfull metal/stone working, live underground and want to take over the world...like devil yodas... if I understand correctly

Norns look like vikings, are somwhat 'giants', and transform into bearlike monsters... they are definitly melee.. the pictures I saw were of a battlefield backround with a woman norn and her 'beast' transformation behind her... she is weilding a ver large sword. definitely melee.

~sylvani are elf-like... are refered to as 'spirits' and may be casters but who knows what the 'race>sex>class>poffession' selection will be???

CuriousCarrie · Mar 23, 2007, 10:37 PM // 22:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Ernada

And there were others, including me, who have opinions as well that were criticisms. But the difference is that I didnt go ranting and whining about how ANET "betrayed" us. Or how GW is dying. Or how GW is just a clone of WoW.

Don't assume that just because I find all this whining annoying and premature, and yes it's whining, that I find ANET to be perfect. I dont like the high level cap or the apparent removal of heroes/henchies, but I speak my opinions without sounding like a kid throwing a tantrum. Just look at your post. Half of it was personal attacks directed towards me when I didnt even mention you at all.

As for your proof that GW2 is a failure just because you talked to a few people in local chat who said they werent going to buy GW2? We are supposed to take that as proof? Hell, the other day people were talking about Hiltler being a hero. So is that proof as well?

I quoted you since you inspired me to write that. I directed part of it at you, with no intent of a personal attack, to make a few things clear after a previous post of yours on page 64, where you also quoted me:

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Ernada

What are you? Ed Mcmahon? Or are you and Ninja the same person? Your'e always there after each of Ninja's post to kiss his feet.

I see that of more of a personal attack than I apparently launched upon you.

I did not present that talking to friends and some people in all chat "proof" of any kind. I am trying to say, that it is not just myself and the "minority" of people in this forum that feel that way. Anet are losing many customers and are making many people unhappy. What has been said so far sounds very much like anything that can be compared with WoW, starting with the design of the asura. If you wish to see it as ranting and whining, go ahead. I think it is just your view of that, since I have an opposing opinion to yours. I am well aware that it is also not just WoW that this game reflects, but WoW has been GW's most competitive rival the past years. As people have mentioned, it reflects games such as Dungeon Siege too. We can also go on to call the upcoming GW2 "Guild Siege", or "Dungeon Wars"... or better yet... "World of Dungeon Wars". Happy?

There are many that say that we are "whining", or perhaps the most aggressive term used to describe "us", was "bitching". Just because we state a more "negative" side of the story does not automatically make us into children who are throwing tantrums. So we have an opposing opinion? Live with it. You will never go through life having everybody agree with you and they will not be throwing a temper tantrum just because they don't agree with you.

We are voicing our concerns and through it being attacked because we are apparently calling out "apocalypse". Many of us just see a game that we chose and fell in love with go to waste, mainly because we see what could be a spectacular sequel, if it were not selling out to be some WoW-wannabe, or whichever game you choose to compare GW2 with.

This is constructive criticism. Perhaps not for you since to your dismay I do happen to have a different opinion than your own, but it also gives the people at Anet an idea, as to what they are getting into. They are losing many many customers who have stuck with them over the past 2 years, perhaps even longer if you include the beta-test. My characters have Divine Aura, which should tell you how long I've stuck with this game. One could call sticking to GW for 2+ years a loyal customer, or player. I'm sure Anet would rather not lose these players. If they see these posts, it is likely to affect the way GW2 comes out, even if it is just Anet taking a knowing risk by making GW2 as described above and losing the "minority" you see here "whining and complaining". We're not evil people just because we have a different opinion. Yes, we add some sarcasm here and there, because we also find it rather ridiculous how you tell us to be quiet and let you continue shouting about how great this will be. What if the "negative" people were in the "majority" and we told you to quit whining and complaining, would you be quiet if you had a good point or perhaps a fear for the upcoming game?

And a question to everyone, why are excited about GW2? Is it because you expect it to be similar to GW1, a game that took risks to be completely different to all other games of its kind out there, and succeeded? Why aren't you playing WoW, other than the monthly costs? Why does it bother you that we compare this game to WoW, amongst others? Would it be that awful to play a WoW-like game for you? Or why are you so hurt and offended when we do compare it to WoW? Sure, there are many things about GW2 that are still different to WoW, but it is also morphing into it, slowly but surely. I like GW, mainly because all of the game playing characteristics that make it so unique, especially compared to WoW. I can switch over to WoW any time I want, I have RL friends who are begging me to, yet, I stick with GW and defend it when they mock me for playing the inferior game. I find GW is a far superior product to WoW and I do not see why Anet have to sell out to other run of the mill games just because it might turn a better profit.

It is not just races and lvl### cap that makes it like WoW and other games, it so far the description, perhaps making it more PvE based rather than the intense PvP game that GW1 once was. Also the artwork is starting to seem very WoW-ish. Again, WoW is just used as the main example because it has been GW's biggest rival the past years and there has always been a rather large rift between WoW and GW players.

PS- I'm not personally attacking everyone, just stating my opinion. For those of you who seem to think I am personally attacking you, please read this post in a different manner and realize I am just stating my side of the story, with no aggression or tantrums from my side. What and how others write in this forum has absolutely nothing to do with me and you should not hold me accountable for their actions, even if we do share the same opinion (ie. the unhappy one).

clawofcrimson · Mar 23, 2007, 10:45 PM // 22:45

and btw... as far a races go... its specifically states that the information may be only 'some' of the playable races...

I for one would like to see the current.. 'creatures' ... able to be played.

dwarves, centaurs, birdmen...anyone?

Banaticus · Mar 23, 2007, 10:58 PM // 22:58

Well, on a thread of this size, an individual post really doesn't mean much.

But, if there are no benefits to leveling, then why would anyone bother doing it? If there are benefits to leveling, then won't everyone want to level to make it easier to defeat current enemies and such? That's the "grind" people talk about. That, if it's easier to defeat your current enemies after leveling a few times, then people go out and "grind" up a few levels then come back and fight the enemies that they were having trouble with.

Perhaps they will make it like City of Heroes (seeing as how the same company owns both games, correct?), where various instances are only for certain levels of people. They already announced that you could sidekick to bring along a lower level character. CoH allows a reverse sidekick, where you go down to their friend's level, in order to get into a lower level instance. I'd like to see something like that.

noocoo · Mar 23, 2007, 11:02 PM // 23:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inde

Eye of the north is a HOLIDAY 2007 RELEASE.

Excuse me...

What does "HOLIDAY 2007" mean?

CuriousCarrie · Mar 23, 2007, 11:07 PM // 23:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by noocoo

Excuse me...

What does "HOLIDAY 2007" mean?

The second half of the year, and since I'm already thought of as a pessimist, probably around Christmas time, 2007. I also saw Q3 somewhere, which means July, August, and September. Either way it means you get to wait and it isn't 6 months after Nightfall. ^^

LordUrial · Mar 23, 2007, 11:15 PM // 23:15

All im gonna say about this is that i hate wow and this is shaping up to be wow in new clothes so i think im gonna have to stick to gw old style.

Zehnchu · Mar 23, 2007, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by noocoo

Excuse me...

What does "HOLIDAY 2007" mean?

I was reading the article, they talked about if campaign four wasn’t scraped it would have been released around the same time as factions (April 28). They went on say to day since there is no campaign four GW:EW will be released a few months after that date “holiday 2007”. I am guessing maybe some time in July.

Gun Pierson · Mar 23, 2007, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Etta

I can see your point, I love BG series as well. You can import your char from BG1 to BG2 yes, but you can not import any of the items, gear, gold to BG2. You can import everything from BG2 to Tob, why? because Tob was an expansion to BG2, same engine, the story pickup where BG2 left off.

And look at GW1 and GW2, the same can be said about Fallout 1 and 2. The stories between the two games take 1 or 2 generations apart. Would it make sense to see same Vault 13 Hero on the second game? Knowing that he would be 90+ years old.

True but the 100 year gap is just the excuse cause really, 100 years in a middle age RPG game like this is nothing. It's not like they will shoot with laserweapons 100 years later, if we're lucky they'll invent the crossbow or something. My point is they could just aswell say it's 5 or 10 years from where GW1 ended and with the option you can take characters over.

Technically about the engine...That might be true, I'm not a specialist.

Anyway I'm not making conclusions too soon. Could be GW2 satisfies my gaming needs. When more screenshots and movies are available and what not I will make a call on buying this game or not as it's an investment of fun for the coming years. In the meantime my gw activities have stopped last two weeks with all the news and stuff and for the first time in 2 years I'm playing some other games. Maybe it's just a short burn out, maybe it's something more, don't know at this point.

dead man ivan · Mar 23, 2007, 11:30 PM // 23:30

I havent seen a single post about the new Cinematic engine so I just wanted to say it sounds exciting. I mean if they can make cinematics like WoW(I love their hiDef type cinematics) something like on the lines they had in GW:Prophecies * Factions. I loved those cinematics and was hoping to see one more Nightfall but I guess they scrapped that for budget sakes. If this new engine can deliver as promised I would love to see some dramatic moments in some cool looking graphics!!

boko · Mar 23, 2007, 11:42 PM // 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuriousCarrie

It is not just races and lvl### cap that makes it like WoW and other games, it so far the description, perhaps making it more PvE based rather than the intense PvP game that GW1 once was. Also the artwork is starting to seem very WoW-ish. Again, WoW is just used as the main example because it has been GW's biggest rival the past years and there has always been a rather large rift between WoW and GW players.

PS- I'm not personally attacking everyone, just stating my opinion. For those of you who seem to think I am personally attacking you, please read this post in a different manner and realize I am just stating my side of the story, with no aggression or tantrums from my side. What and how others write in this forum has absolutely nothing to do with me and you should not hold me accountable for their actions, even if we do share the same opinion (ie. the unhappy one).

We do understand your concern, but it is a bit pointless to assume the worst when ppl do not have enough information. If you did read the article, you would have understood that. And, i am sure that all your fear would be put to rest too.

But, if for some reason, you can't get the article or whatever reason like you can't or don't want to wait, then i am going to try to clear up a bit that you are thinking that is going to bring GW2 to its demise apparently.

If you are worried about the graphism, then i really think you should already think about the current GW engine already? How can you really assume that the devs are so stupid to go backwards and actually adopt a cartoonish look like WoW. The devs are quite proud of what they have accomplished and they have done quite a long way since GW1 Proh release ( e.g facial movement , etc.) The future GW2 is bound to be as good as GW1 if not even better looking since it is going to be 2 years later.

As for the gameplay, the devs do know what is good about GW1. They do know that PvP is one of their best feature. Hence, they did say in the article that they are going to do what is needed to keep a balance GvG/PvP system.
And, you also prolly do know that ANet do organise tournament with real cash involvement. So, it is in their own benefit, to actually create a balanced GvG/PvP system.

The only black spot of GW1 was its PvE, and we all know that. There are better PvE games out there and they do know that. The population of PvE players quite big. And hence, they decided to add more content to PvE content. Moreover, PvEr has their own arena ( world vs world arena which is a bit like the actual AB). In GW2, PvE players would be able to play PvE actually for the PvE content itself, instead of playing PvE to make a PvP/GvG showoff char like in GW1.

In other words, PvP and PvE community will have their own share of game. Maybe even PvP and PvE ppl will be be seperated. BUT, in no way , is PvE content going to affect PvP/GvG.

Hope that does help you

CuriousCarrie · Mar 24, 2007, 12:07 AM // 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by boko

We do understand your concern, but it is a bit pointless to assume the worst when ppl do have not have enough information. If you did read the article, you would have understood that. And, i am sure that all your fear would be put to rest too.

But, if for some reason, you can't get the article or whatever reason like you can't or don't want to wait, then i am going to try to clear up a bit that you are thinking that is going to bring GW2 to its demise apparently.

If you are worried about the graphism, then i really think you should already think about the current GW engine already? How can you really assume that the devs are so stupid to go backwards and actually adopt a cartoonish like WoW. The devs are quite proud of what they have accomplished and they have done quite a long way since GW1 Proh release ( e.g facial movement , etc.) The future GW2 is bound to be as good as GW1 if not even better looking since it is going to be 2 years later.

As for the gameplay, the devs do know what is good about GW1. They do know that PvP is one of their best feature. Hence, they did say in the article that they are going to do what is needed to keep a balance GvG/PvP system.
And, you also prolly do know that ANet do organise tournament with real cash involvement. So, it is in their own benefit, to actually create a balanced GvG/PvP system.

The only black spot of GW1 was its PvE, and we all know that. There are better PvE games out there and they do know that. The population of PvE players quite big. And hence, they decided to add more content to PvE content. Moreover, PvEr has their own arena ( world vs world arena which is a bit like the actual AB). In GW2, PvE players would be able to play PvE actually for the PvE content itself, instead of playing PvE to make a PvP/GvG showoff char like in GW1.

In other words, PvP and PvE community will have their own share of game. Maybe even PvP and PvE ppl will be be seperated. BUT, in no way , is PvE content going to affect PvP/GvG.

Hope that does help you

Thank you boko, for the first non-attacking response I've gotten. Reading/getting a hold of the article is no problem, in fact, I have. I am, however, still not pleased with what I hear.

I mentioned in previous posts of mine, that I'm well aware that the graphics and tech will improve for GW2, for that reason I am excited. That it won't be a step back and be an adoption of any graphics that WoW or previous games have been using is very clear (and if they do... well... -_- then they should be ashamed of themselves). GW itself had wonderful graphics and artwork, part of the reason why I love the game so much, but doesn't the Asura and other artwork already strike you as somewhat familiar... somewhat... cartoonish? It does to me. I've seen read the article and also understand that there will be a lot of technical advances in the upcoming 2 years (I may be a girl, but I heart computers and technology and understand more than most guys give me credit for). I am not at all worried about the graphics in the sense that it will be a "vintage" game or such... then they might as well stick to making campaigns/expansions for GW1. ^^

As much as I am also on some level trying to play devil's advocate, I also really do think that this game is tending in a direction that is no longer "GW". I am perhaps mocking a bit more than necessary, but I'm also trying to make a point with it. GW was nominated and awarded for many prizes because of it's originality, part of the reason millions of players worldwide joined in and played it, the lack of monthly fees being perhaps the first novel idea to draw attention to the game.

I'm all in for the PvE bit. I started off playing more PvP than anything and I have just recently tended towards PvE, for reasons other than making a pretty char. I can see that there are many other games that are perhaps more rich on the PvE level than GW is at the moment. I do not wish to say that there is room for improval, but it seems to me, even after reading all that I have read, that PvP will be "lacking" in GW2 as PvE is "lacking" in GW1. I however, also enjoyed making my PvE chars PvP ready and having my pretty characters fight on that level. If there is no level cap, or a really high one, I doubt it will even be a feature in GW2. GW became so famous as well because of it's competitive PvP. I know that both PvP and PvE are equally important parts of the game.

The part that makes me wonder most is how Anet are going to be able to cope with keeping both GW1 and GW2 running. Sometimes it seems that they are unable to cope with GW1 as is, bringing updates on time, skill balances, and I know the GvG community is still waiting for the whole "mini-tournament" part to be fully set into play. At times it seems that they have already bitten off more than they can chew with GW, which will in 2 years time be utterly inferior to the technological demands of GW2. And often times Anet had promises and goals for GW1 that they could not uphold, and what about GW2?

I love GW! There is no doubt about it. It is perhaps the game I've enjoyed the most in my entire gaming "career". I also enjoyed it so much because it wasn't WoW or Dungeon Siege or anything of the likeness. The playstyle, PvP, graphics, everything were something new, and the monthly fees just put it over the top. It is why I find it sad that it seems that Anet are selling out to the other games from which they tried to distance themselves at the beginning.

I have as much information as everyone else does, so it is as pointless for me to assume the worst, as it is for everyone else to assume the best.

Derek · Mar 24, 2007, 12:09 AM // 00:09

About the higher lvl cap. I really doubt that it will be a problem, I mean in GW 1 you can get max lvl by just following the main storyline, so why couldn't you achieve that in GW 2 (most likely has a story?)?

Oh and also me and my Guild Leader were thinking that it would be interesting of the Attribute, hp and nrgy gaining would stop at a lvl, say 20-50 or somewhere there, and after that the levels you gain won't affect your char, but they would work as a title or something. A leveling title.

From what I've read I find GW 2 really interesting and just can't WAIT for it. The new races sound really cool (which of course are Norns, Charr, Asuras and the Sylvari which all will be introduced in GWEN, althought we already know about the Charr).

Lady Lozza · Mar 24, 2007, 12:16 AM // 00:16

GW: Eye of the North (GWEN), Gwen... I like what they did

Gwen in a green dress... Is it possible that the mesmer concept art is Gwen? I've not seen the article so I've no idea what the pic is like...

Retribution X · Mar 24, 2007, 12:24 AM // 00:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by clawofcrimson

warrior asurans?? um no.... if you read the article you would know this is not the case. they pride themselves in knowledge and skillfull metal/stone working, live underground and want to take over the world...like devil yodas... if I understand correctly

Norns look like vikings, are somwhat 'giants', and transform into bearlike monsters... they are definitly melee.. the pictures I saw were of a battlefield backround with a woman norn and her 'beast' transformation behind her... she is weilding a ver large sword. definitely melee.

~sylvani are elf-like... are refered to as 'spirits' and may be casters but who knows what the 'race>sex>class>poffession' selection will be???

I don't have the article. Wish I did. :'(

I so want a Sylvani. They sound cool.

Loviatar · Mar 24, 2007, 12:27 AM // 00:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zehnchu

I was reading the article, they talked about if campaign four wasn’t scraped it would have been released around the same time as factions (April 28). They went on say to day since there is no campaign four GW:EW will be released a few months after that date “holiday 2007”. I am guessing maybe some time in July.

to all the people making wishful guesses on this you are flat wrong.

IN THE STATES THERE IS ONE AND ONLY ONE HOILDAY SEASON FOR BUYING GIFTS.......CHRISTMAS

there is no buying season for Easter
there is no buying season for the 4th of July
there is no buying season for Halloween
the only time someone refers to the *holiday season* (including the game industry) is Christmas.

otherwise it is 1/2/3/4 quarter or spring/summer/fall release